Shallow reds video (review and a question)

[preast]

Purchased the Troutsupport shallow water redfish video. Watched once so far and agree with others that it contains a huge amount of great information, and also concepts that would never have occurred to me as factors. I'm relatively inexperienced in SW but still the topics were advanced ones I don't see get discussed. I think it will help me with a game plan for any day I hit the flats, where before I mostly went off superficial signs of fish and conditions.

I have an additional question about locating fish. The video spends a fair amount of time on the foundations of why fish are where they are, which is awesome. I like fishing shallow water, usually AP or POC so fairly clear water. I get the difference between mullet and reds as far as their movement and the boils they make. My question is how important is it to actually see reds? Do most of you go off of surface signs or actually spot fish? I fly fish out of a Tarpon 120 so I'm not gonna be standing up. Most of the time I feel like stuff is going on around me but I'm flying blind. Or I blast over fish without knowing they're there and all I see is a boil and a wake. Do I just need to go slower or get better at seeing fish?

[Cityfisher]

That's a good question, and to tell you the truth, I have only caught a few after seeing them. Most of the time for me, I don't see them, but I will cast around some structure where I think they would be positioned. Saturday I saw a huge blow up close by and some big wakes that I am fairly certain were reds but I couldn't get them to bite. But I caught one casting over a point with shell jetting out thinking one may be behind there waiting on something to get blown over it and ambush it. Sure enough one was there. Actually seeing the fish isn't that important to me, but looking for the right signs, as is explained in the DVD is.

[F.O.C.]

Do I just need to go slower or get better at seeing fish?

Both. When I take someone and its their first time, they usually want to paddle fast. So I put them in the big kayak. Takes the fire right out of them
Its easier to learn to read the water when they slow down. Its cool to watch someones expression when they figure it out after explaining what to look for and countless "there they are right there can you see them?"

Stay at it. You'll find them reds!

[JMS]

Great question interested in what others have to say. Have yet to see a fish cast and catch it

[Jedi]

The trick when seeing a red is to determine which way the head is facing( this is referring to tailing reds). If there is a huge wake then you know which way it is heading. Then your ability to cast accurately becomes very important. If you don't see them, knowing the places that should hold them(like said above) is priceless.

[Kayak Kid]

I must give Slowride full credit for teaching me the following method when fishing for shallow water/flats/marsh reds:

Paddle to a spot that gives you a view of as much of the area's water as possible. Pull into the shoreline, bank or anchor your yak, and relax for about 15 minutes.

First using eyesight, and then binoculars, carefully study the water beginning out about 2 yards, and extending as far as 100 yards. Begin looking for signs of bait and/or fish. Depending on water clarity, position of the sun, and direction of the wind, you will begin to see wakes, or backs, or tails, or red flashes, or bait signs. Experience and discussions with other fishermen will teach you what to look for.

If, after a period of time (depends on your patience), you fail to see anything interesting, then slowly move on to another spot and repeat the process. This is just one of many methods that you will learn to incorporate when fishing for reds.

[TrailChaser]

If I'm fishing the flats I'm seeing at least 75% of the reds I'm catching before I cast to them. Check out my flats videos, I'm casting directly to them and then waiting a couple/few seconds for the blow-up. (I hope posting these video links here is okay)

Personal favorite.(fishing on my birthday)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AE4_wAjA-jQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

profanity warning* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjK-QR640fM" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmdm995XKx4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In my experience if the water is less than a foot deep the reds can feel your kayak with their lateral lines and act like it's something that's after them,(it is) but when I get out of the kayak and just slowly slide my feet wading toward them I can literally get close enough to poke them with my rod tip or just reach down and grab them barehanded.

I would love to see the trout support videos someday. I need to put them on my christmas list.

[preast]

Thanks for the replies and nice videos.

Sounds like it's most common to spot the signs of a fish at a distance rather than actually seeing the fish itself closer up. So maybe the ones that I'm spooking aren't really feeding anyway? Because I see no evidence of them, like they're sitting there resting. I've managed to catch a few tailing reds on flies but those fish are obvious and it seems like the exception. I was fooled a few times by sheepshead tails until I figured that out.

The usual drill for me is to get there at daylight to catch a few tailers, then paddle around spooking the crap out of everything, and blindcasting the miscellaneous spots like potholes, guts, etc. I only go a couple times a year so maybe I just don't go often enough to hit a day with numbers of fish on the flats. I think I need to use some of the information I've learned about the right locations, and then slow down and pay more attention. Or I may have to beg one of you guys to let me tag along to see how this is done.

[TrailChaser]

Redfish swim very slow and steady until they see something to eat. Sometimes they will bury their head in the grass and just sit perfectly still like they're sleeping. Or when they're going after shrimp/little crabs they'll have the ol tail out. I can't remember having a redfish on the flats see my live mullet and not nail it with a vengeance. With artificial baits I get that reaction sometimes, but sometimes they ignore it or it spooks them. I've had two swimming together and first one swims to my gulp, stops, turns and swims a few feet away, the second one comes over and checks out the gulp then just makes it disappear without moving a muscle. I'm positive that first red would have nailed a live fingermullet.(caught the second one)

Low tide in the morning is the best conditions for spotting them. Right now we are having some pretty high morning tides and I've only been able to spot a few schools early, but once they break up I don't see many signs/fins of reds even tho I know they're still there. Usually in those conditions if I set on reds I'll find a nice big open sand bed surrounded by grass with a couple of redfish roads leading to and from. I'll just let my mullet swim in the sandy area till one strolls by and nails it. Lots of accidental flounder have been caught doing this.(accidental flounder still taste great)

[eightweight]

I don't blind cast a lot. I'm usually sight casting, with a fly rod.

Sitting low in a kayak, you have to be pretty close to actually see the body of the fish, I think less than 30 feet or so, and that usually means he's seen you, spooked, and running. More often than not, I'm looking for a tail, a back, or a wake, "surface sign" as you call it, that give him away.

[volintexas]

I'm in a similar situation. I also have a Tarpon 120, and I have watched the Shallow Redfish DVD 3 times (I learn so much every time through).

One thing that I noticed on my last trip was that I have a hard time seeing the subtle signs of bait when the water is even a little choppy. I had been out for several hours and done nothing but spook fish left and right. Just as I was about to call it quits for the day, the water got dead calm and I could see signs of "nervous" water. I ended up hooking into my first ever redfish on my second cast after that.

I think for me (and maybe for you as well) I just need to get better at spotting the nervous water or the subtle signs of bait movement when the water isn't dead flat.

I hope that's the case, anyway. I am getting really tired of only seeing the fish after I have spooked them.

[preast]

I think you have a point about the surface chop. It does seem like I have less luck with finding fish as the morning goes on and the wind starts to kick up. Maybe I'm just expecting too much too soon. But it helps to know what "too much" is.

Eightweight, I prefer your method but I gotta make do when I'm down there so I might break out an intermediate 8wt line or even the spinning rod.

[Tombo]

I like to use the video method compared to snapshot. In other words, stop at a spot and take it in for couple minutes. You might be surprised at what you see as opposed to a quick look.

[billy bobba]

One needs to put in a lot of time on the water to become confident about your ability to find, see and sight cast fish. The biggest mistakes I see anglers making are :

-- Going too fast. You have to go slow and look carefully, as with stealth hunting any game. Look for small signs and focus your attention there for awhile.
-- Being too noisy. Over time you learn that even the slightest noise will push fish away or send them deep. Your equipment must be rigged to be silent as well. Hull slap from the wrong type of kayak hull will ruin your chances.
-- Being distracted. Talking with buddies etc. will break your focus.
-- Too much standing / wading. Learn to approach fish and cast while sitting in the yak. You are much more stealthy from a sitting position and you will learn to see fish from that low position. Yes - you can see fish better with height - but they can also see you better.

Go slow
Stay silent
Remain low
Be focused

Of course the first thing one looks for are the obvious fish that are tailing or showing their backs etc. Here's a somewhat long video I made showing tailing Reds in different light conditions and in different feeding modes.

https://vimeo.com/104642071" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[redneckyakclub01]

One more thing to think about is that spooking them is not always a bad thing. Oftentimes when a red swims away it's not really spooked. I've found that when I see a red swim away from me and disappear that I can cast just past the point where I could last see it and get a hookup. Even when they bolt and leave a wake, they often stop within a cast distance. I usually give them a moment and then cast to the end of the wake. I've even caught a few on desperation casts at reds that were spooked and appear d to be heading nonstop to the next county.

[Thinwater skinner]

Go slow
Stay silent
Remain low
Be focused

Great advice.

https://vimeo.com/104642071" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

WOW what a film to learn by... I wonder how many pounds of shrimp and crabs were eaten in the combined shots you strung together? Nice Very Nice!!!!

Thanks for sharing.

[TroutSupport.com]

Your eyes will get trained over time and you'll see more and more you didn't see even in chop, it's all about applying the information in the video. Sometimes I will blind cast a high percentage area when the conditions aren't right for sightcasting. If you put yourself in the right areas based on the information from the video then you can still catch redfish. Bumping one or two is actually a good thing... at least you know you're getting close and there are some fish around. JP Chavez said in the video... paddle until you start to spook a fish or two. Good advice.

JP is a hell of a fisherman and great guy, if ya'll get a chance to go with him this winter, it's well worth it.

t

[Kingz]

Lotta good info...I agree with above, stay low and in your yak, you can get close...

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[TroutSupport.com]

Very good info for sure.

[preast]

Yep, and much appreciated.

BB, I remember seeing your videos before but probably now see it with different eyes. Still I have never seen anything like that so far. Just 1s and 2s tailing.

Tobin, I think I'm starting to put more pieces together. I probably haven't had a lot of confidence I'm fishing the right areas once I don't see obvious sign. I get impatient and don't properly work the area. We'll see next time. Thanks all.

[Salty Bum]

I had the same issue when I started at AP. I would not see the fish unless it was tailing until it was too late and the swirl and mud ball. The next time that happened I just stopped and looked around where the red was and why and etc. etc. etc. The next time it happened i thought it was a Red but was not sure and it was. It seemed for the longest time I was never going to be a great site fisherman and I can still say today I'm not great but better each time I go out. I really like the advice given in post above. "Tight Lines"

[Kingz]

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Sometimes all you get is a wink...
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Fish prob 6-8 feet from the yak when it hit...low and slow ...G

[TroutSupport.com]

Nice work.. perfect presentation.